[IRP] FW: IRP meeting - Geneva May 9th

Lisa Horner LisaH
Sun May 9 14:11:10 EEST 2010

From: Lisa Horner
Sent: 09 May 2010 11:54
To: Mazzone, Giacomo
Cc: irp at lists.internerightsandprinciples.org; andrewrens at gmail.com; wang4xin at hotmail.com; rsaba1 at palermo.edu
Subject: RE: IRP meeting - Geneva May 9th

Thank you for these comments on the Charter Giacomo.  I've forwarded on to the coalition and experts.

From: Mazzone, Giacomo
Sent: samedi, 8. mai 2010 23:23
To: 'Lisa Horner'
Subject: RE: IRP meeting - Geneva May 9th

Dear Lisa,

Many thanks for remembering me of this opportunity. In the meantime I?ve been made aware that there are risks of concrete closure of the Geneva airport tomorrow morning, so could be that I?ll not be able to leave for my meeting in Rome. I hope that ?on the other side- all attended participants will be able to arrive in town.

In any case, I shall try to attend (in person, in the worst scenario) or via mobile connection (if I shall be able to access any where I shall be in Rome)?

In any case, my best compliment for the excellent work that has been made. Since the last September meeting the charter has progressed a lot and many issues have been now included and considered.

Nevertheless, after a first reading, I still find some elements missing. I try to summarize here and I shall try to make clearer tomorrow if I shall be able to join you in a way or another.

These are my first remarks:

1.       The charter is called CHARTER OF HUMAN RIGHTS AND PRINCIPLES ON THE INTERNET. This is a limitation from my point of view, because we are talking of all rights related to any on line and digital sphere, not only the Internet. But with the hybrid systems, these rights could be affected also using a mobile device or even a radio or a TV set. The same sets of rules is intended to apply also to those users, that could be even not aware that they are using IP? So I would suggest to call ON THE INTERNET & the ON LINE (or DIGITAL) WORLD
I don?t see any mention of the right to the cultural diversity, but only a very light reference to the right to the diversity of languages (that is only a small fraction of the cultural diversity matter). I would like to see a clearly and specific mention to the right to the cultural diversity; Today is said: The internet should represent a diversity of cultures and languages in terms of appearance and functionality. (APC-IRP)
I would say, instead, ?each digital citizen maintain in the digital world his full right to his own cultural diversity? at the beginning of the article, and then I shall follow with the rest;

2.       I see a very light reference to access to public information, when ?in my opinion- we would have to underline the right to have a strong and clear and broad definition of ?public domain? and ?public right to access to knowledge and culture?, that defines all that is not privately owned and includes what is collectively owned, or paid by public money (like for instance what is produced by libraries, archives, public service broadcasting), of course after a reasonable lapse of time. Until we shall not have a clear vision of this right, we shall assist to progressive and endless extensions of duration of the copyright, with the only scope to benefit few companies. From this broader right to access public domain derive many rights (that are already mentioned, but in a non systematic way) within the Charter, such as  the right to access to public information, the right to access to education and educative materials, the concept of ?non commercial use? and so on

3.       DIGITAL IDENTITY : I don?t see mentioned a very basic point, that is that individuals (as well as companies or associations) keep their right to their identity within the real world even in the digital world. There have been companies that have protected under their patents domain names of family names, companies or association asking later money for getting back these names. A sort of TLD kidnapping. Today the procedure is that the person that has been stolen need to open a trial or a procedure for getting back his own identity. And this is , frankly speaking, unacceptable. Has to be the other way round? A clear ?Right to the protection of own names? has to be established, as well needs to be define the post-mortem rights to the digital material produced and available on the net.

4.     Right to Information

Everyone has the right to receive and impart information and ideas through the internet. (Excerpt from Art. 19 UDHR, BE)

               I?m not satisfied with the wording of this principle. It applies only to a part of our world, where still there are explicit limits to the freedom of expression. But we?re not anymore in the age when this principle was expressed , that was the age of the scarcity of information and of the state censorship. Nowadays in many recognized democratic countries censorships occurs through the flooding of contradictory information. The problem is not any more the fact that the information is hidden by the power, but more and more that the information is too abundant, and sometime false or unreliable (and often this is the result of cynical intervention of groups of interests or of branches of governments).  We need so to remember that every citizen has the right to receive or to produce information, BUT also that this information has to be an unbiased, reliable and trustful information. By converse, it exists a duty for who produce it ,that this information has to be in ?bona fide? and needs to be as much correct as possible. Any propagation of information that is known to be false or defamatory needs to be discouraged, and when it comes from public or institutional sources needs to be heavily sanctioned.
Instead than having a separate point for Freedom from Hate Speech
I would include this paragraph in the previous one about Right of Information. Because it exists the right to inform, but also the righ to receive reliable and hate-free information. So
Hate speech and hate media need clearly to be sanctioned as well when they are aimed to the moral or physical offence or even to the elimination of the other?

I don?t see why, if we have people under trial in Den Hague for hate speech through radio, why we don?t have the same sanctions when if it happens through the Internet or any other digital media.

I hope these contributions could help and I wish you a fruitful meeting.
All the best


From: Lisa Horner [mailto:LisaH at global-partners.co.uk]
Sent: vendredi, 7. mai 2010 13:27
To: Mazzone, Giacomo
Subject: FW: IRP meeting - Geneva May 9th

Dear Giacomo

I hope you received the email I just sent about the Irp coalition meeting (below).  You are very welcome to join us remotely from Brussels if you are there/in person/for dinner.

I?ll be on +44 7867 795859 if you need to contact me.

Looking forward to seeing you soon.

All the best,

From: irp-bounces at lists.internetrightsandprinciples.org [mailto:irp-bounces at lists.internetrightsandprinciples.org] On Behalf Of Lisa Horner
Sent: 07 May 2010 12:11
To: irp at lists.internetrightsandprinciples.org
Subject: [IRP] IRP meeting - Geneva May 9th

Dear all

We have now had drafts of the Charter from the expert group.  I?ve uploaded everything onto Google docs, and linked to it from the IRP website here: http://internetrightsandprinciples.org/node/348

Please read the explanatory note that you will find there, which explains that the documents we have are still only drafts, and also outlines the rationale behind the approaches the experts have taken.

There is also an agenda for the meeting ? feel free to comment and add anything you?d like to be discussed.

For people attending the meeting in person: Please meet at the Maison des Associations (http://www.lafea.org/contacts.htm) at 12.00 sharp if you?d like to join us for lunch.  The meeting will begin in the Steve Biko room at 13.30 CET.

For people attending the meeting remotely: We are using the dim dim participation platform.  You can join the meeting here:

1)      Click on the link at 13.30 CET

2)      Enter your name

3)      You will now be in the meeting.  You should be able to hear the audio from the room, and see a video of the room.

4)      You will be able to chat via text to us and other remote participants throughout the meeting.  Dixie will be monitoring the chat in the meeting.  You can ask questions/make comments on an ongoing basis which we will then respond to.

5)      If you would like to speak vocally during the meeting, please let Dixie know via the chat function.  We will then allocate you a microphone at an opportune time (there are only 3 virtual microphones so we can?t give them to all at once).  Your computer will ask you for permission for dim dim to access your microphone.  You should then be able to speak to the meeting by holding the microphone button down when you want to talk.  Once you have made your contribution, we will take the microphone back so we can allocate it to someone else.

6)      For more info, please see http://onlinehelp.dimdim.com/getstarted/JoinMeeting.html

Please note that this is the first time we?ve used the platform.  We apologise if there are any hiccups, or if the internet connection isn?t very good.

As always, feel free to make any comments/ask questions.

Looking forward to seeing you in person or virtually on Sunday!

All the best,

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